Political banter on Facebook...

My friend Damon had some really brilliant comments



Jesse
How about the thousands of our soldiers, plus the innocent civilians who have died in the middle east. Get out now!!!! Mr. President, time to end the war.
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/soldiers-killed-fort-hood-shooting/story?id=9007938

Nathan
There are a lot of people who are messed up by this tragedy, and need prayer and support...so incredibly sad.

David
No, don't get out. Get in and win. WE are in a war with Islam, whether anybody wants to admit it or not. It is not the Iraqis we are at war with. I have two Iraqi friends on Facebook (they are Christians that are glad we came to help them). They are wonderful people, not because they are Iraqis, but because they are Christians. We must help the defenseless.

Jesse
Certainly Nidal Malik Hasan deserves the death sentence. I'm not really a fan of the death penalty, but I think there should be some exceptions. Let's get out of foreign entanglements like our founding fathers intended and protect our own country at home. David, we cannot continue to kill Muslims and expect more peace, there is no logic in that.

David
I don't believe in the death penalty as you know - but a life time of water boarding etc. would be good for Hasan.

Nathan
2 things:
1) This tragedy shouldn't be used for political fodder.
2) David, why don't you finish our conversation?

Jesse
Nathan, this tragedy is being politicized beyond respect. But people need to wake up, we need to end these foreign entanglements.
I'm praying for the families, can certainly understand not using these situations to simply bolster one's point.

Nathan
David, I just have to ask if you really believe that Christianity is in a war with Islam? I hope you stop saying We in that, and change it to I, as I am both Christian and American, and am not at war with Islam. I hope you read my 2nd last musing on pacifism, Islam and the Isa.

Katie
you go nathan.

David
Yes you guys are right - Islam is not at war with Christianity, and Hitler love the Jews too. Chamberlain was way smarter than Churchill. Obama is a conservative. Pigs actually do fly.
The earth really is flat. The moon really is made of cheese. A cow really did jump over the moon. Blah, blah, blah, blah. blah. :D

Jesse
thanks for showing up Katie

Erika
So there is no real evidence besides his name that this had anything to do with Islam. This, in my opinion, might just be some cowardly asshole whos years of schooling to be a phsyciatrist apparently did nothing to cure him of his own neurosis. We aren't at war with Islam, we are at war with the spread of Hate and Fear. That two headed monster disguises itself in many religions, including Christianity.

Tim
praying for ft hood

David
Erika - ". . . real evidence besides his name. . ." ? You're kidding right? Of course schooling to be a psycholigist didn't help him - mine shot himself (of course maybe I drove him over the edge like Bob did). He was a "devout" Muslim all his life. He attended the same mosque that 3 of the 911 terrorists did. He handed out Korans. He did ... Read Moremany other things too numerous to list here. Mohammad and the Koran taught spreading Islam by military conquest. The New Testament and Jesus Christ does not.

Michael
I read that witnesses reported that he was shouting 'Alahu Akbar' (Allah is Great!) when he opened fire. Do any of you guys know if that's been confirmed?

Erika
K, well that wasn't in anything I read, but I can believe the guy was a muslim. That doesn't make him a terrorist. He could be a crazy muslim terrorist, but that doesnt mean that I am at war with Islam or that I should be. As long as my muslim neighbor can respect my right to worship how I choose, I will return that respect. Actually, Im not sure what being "at war" with Islam would entail. Could you enlighten

David
We did not declare war on Islam - they can worship as they please, but not kill us because we're not Muslim. They kill those who convert from Islam to Christianity (it is often called honor killing and is part of their "law" they want to impose in every nation. All the nations that are Muslim were conquored through war, not through conversion. ... Read MoreWhat is now Turkey use to be Christian, now it is all Islamic due to war, not conversion. The Koran tells Muslims to not be friends with Jews or Christians. The purpose of Islam is conquest of the world, not conversion. I could quote the Koran and Hadith to show you, but space is limited right now.
You have the sweet Christian attitude, just don't be naive - be vigilant.

Erika
K, but how do we war with Islam? What exactly do you suggest we do?

David
First educate ourselve and others about Islam. Second don't be afraid to speak up and NO be politically correct (cowardice). Third know their history. Four (should be 1st) convert them to Christianity. Islam says they believe Jesus was a great prophet, but that Mohammad was the last and greatest. Islam says Jesus was is NOT the Son of God and ... Read Morethat to say so is deserving of death. Islam says Jesus was NOT crucified and died for our sins. Acknowledge Islam wants to make all nations Islamic and under Islamic shiria law.
Acknowledge there are good people who are under Islamic control, but would like to escape it and can't for fear of death.

Nathan
How do you expect to have a conversation? I appreciate that you aren't politically correct, but you should support your claims with evidence, otherwise you're just another blowhard.

How many Muslim friends do you have? Not one of mine have ever disrespected my religion as you do (to both mine and theirs). Have you ever read the poetry of Rumi or studied Sufism? What you say about Jesus is also true in Judaism. So two questions for you:

1. If the Jews under Hitler had been Muslims, would it have been OK? ... Read More

And then, 2. If Christianity is at war with Islam, whose side is God on?

David
Answers: #1 - no; #2 - Islam is at war with Christianity, and everybody are not Muslim.
Yes, I know several people from Iraq that escaped with their lives because they became Christians.
I do disrespect Islam, not individuals, but the false religion - including that of the Jews.

Damon
Classic demonstration of Hegelian dialectic...how the elite manipulates the masses into conflicts with each other instead of seeing what's going on at the top. Read Brzezinski's book Grand Chessboard to see why we're in Iraq/Afghan (he's the top US strategist). Has nothing to do with the media story. Has to do with energy, peak oil, natural gas... Read More, opium, China/Russia, and the psychopathic fear that controls people like Brzezinski, Kissinger, Rockefeller, and the rest of the scum that rule the world...they run DC...politicians don't.

The media you're paying attention to is the media that tells us Oswald shot JFK, WMDs were in Iraq, Gulf of Tonkin was real, McDonalds is good for kids, war is peace, taxes are investment, Dems and Repubs are good, etc. It's dangerous to trust what they say about Hasan, or anything else. When will humanity turnoff the TV and therefore the elite's ability to maintain control? I don't believe Jesus obsessed about getting daily updates on news coming out of Rome.


David
OMG! Are you telling me I've been sucked into believeing a conspiracy? What about the conspiracy of Islam? i'm listening to Savage Nation - He is a man almost as insightful as myself.

Damon
Conspiracies are what drive the course of human history. To do anything requires people getting together to plan it, so if people don't believe in them, they're completely delusional...they would have to believe humans don't exist.

But yeah you've been sucked in if you think poor people in deserts on the other side of the world are going to kill ... Read Moreyou. Whereas if they're believing the same thing about us, they're actually right...we've done it for ages, the Brits carved up their territories to split their tribes (I guess that's better than exterminating them like our natives), the Brits established the evil Arabian royalty, we made Saddam what he was, we put in the Iranian govts that pissed off the people so much the theocrats took over, we created Bin Laden, we put in Karzai an ex-Unocal guy (we're there for natural gas obviously), we stripped their territories with corporations, and now we're killing them in droves.

Focus on the billionaires and royal scum that make this stuff happen instead of the little people who get manipulated and used by them to fly planes into buildings. Go after the elite power structure as Jesus did with the money changers instead of joining the crusade to kill the little people.

Damon
Anyway with Hasan, doesn't anyone find it interesting that public support for Afghan/Iraq was down massively right at the time they were trying to ramp up forces in Afghan, and all of a sudden a middle eastern looking guy shoots a bunch of americans? Will surely crank up the fear factor and get the approval ratings back up. No doubt Obama will ... Read Moreget his massive increase in Afghan forces now. The dark side of the empire continues...kill 'em all!! I hope the more faithful, hopeful, loving sentiments of Nathan and Erika prevail in the midst of our crazy media matrix.

David
Darn that Illumanati! Darn those Masons! Darn the CFR! Darn the Bilderburgers! Darn Satan! Darn the Industrial Military complex! Darn everybody except the ones actually attacking us sin about 623 a.d.!

David
Actually, those darn Martians are behind everything. Martians killed all the Jews, not Hitler. Martians ran the crusades. Martians Killed Kennedy. Martians killed Lincoln.
Martians star blew up the Hindenburg. Martians started the Democrat Party. Yup, I see Martians - hey, maybe I am one -
you can't know for sure.

Damon
Sorry you can't process the facts I discussed.

CFR is real...we just handed trillions over to some of them. I know several of them. Went to school with them. Worked for them. If you're cool with handing over your kids' future wealth to them, cool. But if they can pull that off, what makes you think they can't pull off their foreign affairs ... Read Moreplans? I might as well join them since the people they stole trillions from just insult me for trying to wake them up. It's going to be way better to be on their side if the republic refuses to wakeup and take power back from Wall St/DC.

Regarding the people you claim have been attacking us. Note it's the forces of the state, the elite, the powers that be that manipulated the little people into doing it. Just like Islam has been hijacked by royals and nation-states, so has Christianity throughout history. The problem isn't people who think differently from you. The problem is the people who claim a monopoly of power over them (and us) to lead them (and us) into attacking you (and them). Watch Braveheart again for a lesson in how little people should realize their opponents aren't the little people on the other side of the border but the elite on both sides that pit the people against each other.

Damon
wow...I didn't think they'd prove my prediction true so fast...from CBS:

(CBS) Tonight, after months of conferences with top advisors, President Obama has settled on a new strategy for Afghanistan. CBS News correspondent David Martin reports that the president will send a lot more troops and plans to keep a large force there, long term.

this is... Read More what the planners really wanted...long-term US presence to create a vassal state and maintain control of the natural gas outside Russia's grasp. I know Fox and Savage haven't told you this David, but that doesn't mean it's from Mars...Brzezinski wrote a book saying this in the 90s. It's amazing that they can put their plans in the public domain in books yet people will still deny it.

Nathan
Damon, normally I would dismiss you as a conspiracy nut, but compared to David, you seem absolutely brilliant. I hope that wasn't too much of a backhanded compliment. I really don't know how to handle this news about AfPak. The man rejected the invasion of Iraq when it was "unpatriotic" to do so, and gave one of the most brilliant speeches on his ... Read Moreanti-war stance, that was right up there with Ike's speech on our "Military Industrial Complex." He's completely flip-flopped, and we now have more private Xe contractors in the area than ever before. I can't help but think something is afoot. I'd love to take a look at your "conspiracy theories."

David
Actually, I use to be a total conspiracy theory guru. I was a Chapter leader in the John Birch Society in the 1960's. My best friends in those days had worked for Robert Welch at the John Birch Society headquarters. I infiltrated Highlander Folk School (a Communist training center) and met Ralph Abernathy there and was given a book by Carl & Ann Braden called "The House UnAmerican Activities Committee: Bulwork of Segregation." I was attacked a 33rd degree Mason in Church when I was preaching about all this. I gave a speech to a group of Bankers and others about the Federal Reserve System conspiracy. I read "The Protocals of the Learned Elder's of Zion." I moved to Montana from Florida in 1976 because I thought the Communists were going to invade us.
I use to think the Lord Jesus Christ would return at any moment and the World would be destroyed. I use to believe Satan ruled this "present" world.

The World isn't going to end. Satan is not in power. There are conspiracies, but since Jesus Christ is the King of all now it really doesn't all make much differance.
... Read More
I have a positive outlook thanks to my Preterist World view.
I do believe the Communists and Muslims are at war with us, but they won't win. I just don't want the "Rock" to remain small any longer than possible - I want it to become a "Mountain" that fills the whole earth. Communists and Muslims cause suffering, death of innocent people.

I say a lot to create thought and study. Some of what I say I believe - some I don't. :)

Nathan
Christians cause so much of the worlds' suffering too, as do Atheists, Jews, even Hindus, and Buddhists. I want to bring my kids into a world where we can all hold our own sacred identities, creeds, and religious doctrines, but instead of walls to separate, build bridges into our self-identifying lives.
David, I assume you know who CS Lewis was. This is what he wrote in Mere Christianity:

"The world does not consist of 100 percent Christians and 100 percent non-Christians. There are people (a great many of them) who are slowly ceasing to be Christians but who still call themselves by that name: some of them are clergymen."
"There are other people who are slowly becoming Christians though they do not yet call themselves so. There are people who do not accept the full Christian doctrine about Christ but who are so strongly attracted by Him that they are His in a much deeper sense than they themselves understand." ... Read More
"There are people in other religions who are being led by God’s secret influence to concentrate on those parts of their religion which are in agreement with Christianity, and who thus belong to Christ without knowing it. For example, a Buddhist of good will may be led to concentrate more and more on the Buddhist teaching about mercy and to leave in the background (though he might still say he believed) the Buddhist teaching on certain other points. Many of the good Pagans long before Christ’s birth may have been in this position. And always, of course, there are a great many people who are just confused in mind and have a lot of inconsistent beliefs all jumbled up together. Consequently, it is not much use trying to make judgments about Christians and non-Christians in the mass."

I think you could learn a lot from him.

PS-Are you a universalist or a relativist, David? Because after the way I annihilate you in our online discourse, only a universalist would think he was still right. Of course I think that I'm always right, but I know that I'm probably right only about 70% of the time. The key is to figure out which 30% I'm wrong about, and let other people convince me otherwise. You, my friend have yet to contribute.

Damon
Nathan, just go with your gut, what you obviously see. Don't let the professional PR staffers that control both parties explain away what you're feeling right now in your gut...no doubt his script writers will have powerful heart-tugging words to say to keep people on board later. But just remember what you're seeing right now...he said one thing... Read More to get people to vote for him. Now he's doing what every other president has done--turned his back on the people who put him in office. Who do they work for? What agenda are they enacting if not the people's? The facts are clear. Just read Brzezinski to understand why Obama is doubling down in Afghan...the strategy is published, it's not conspiracy. Another good question to ask yourself: why did both parties steal trillions from us to payoff super rich folks? This is the one that got me to realize what the "conspiracists" say isn't crazy at all. It was the biggest mafia shakedown in history. If you understand the banking industry, the debt-based dollar, and the economic structures of big vs. small, it's very clear what's happening...we're heading toward a more feudal structure of society controlled by financial oligarchs. They've already destroyed many countries, so why would we be so arrogant to think it couldn't happen here? People don't realize they already have the ability to make us destitute over night...just take away liquidity at the top of the pyramid (almost happened Sep 08) and the entire corporate structure shuts down. Well, who supports themselves nowadays? Who can feed themselves? Who provides their own water supply? Who powers their life with their own fuel? We're in quite a pickle now that we're all completely dependent on mega-corporations, and they're all dependent on the mega banks, and there's only 3 of those now (JPM, Citi, BoA), all coordinated by the NY establishment, and they're all dependent on the asset owners behind the Banks of China and Japan. This is just the factual reality of the dollar hierarchy...presidents are almost irrelevant given this power structure...the president is completely dependent on the Fed and its sister central banks. You would do well to join local coops and start establishing some form of self-sustainability. We're all stuck under a control system we never knew existed--debt-based money and the bond/currency market--the stock market is puny in comparison. This market is about to restructure the world. By 2050 US and China standards of living will be the same. That means we have a long way down to go, and they have a long way up. This is why a lot of people who understand finance have already moved from the US to Asia.

Damon
David, I'm impressed you were in JBS. Take away all the higher stuff you mention like the Protocols, the commies, the illuminati, etc. and the basics of what they said about the Fed was/is true. I don't know about the higher level stuff...but whether it's true or crazy nutjob stuff is irrelevant. The mechanics of the dollar, debt, banks are ... Read Morebasic facts of a story that can be read if you know how to read it. What people said about the Fed in the 20's came true yet they were at the time dismissed as conspiracists. What people said about it in the 50's came true, yet they were dismissed. What people said in the 70's, 80's, 90's, 2000's has come true, yet they're still dismissed. Now the WTO/G20 momentum toward global economic union is becoming more clear. The debt situation of the US is clear...we're owned by Asian bankers...national foreclosure is coming...it's not conspiracy, it's the economic facts of the situation we've been put in by the Fed's monetary system. The Fed, and therefore the Wall St cartel, are more powerful than the president. And their long-term agenda is clear.

Jesse
Nathan, I know you can annihilate me in some topics such as health care. However, I'm sure someone else can annihilate you on the same topic; does that mean you'll change your mind? Douglas Wilson and Christopher Hitchens have debates on topics of God; and Wilson admits Hitchens is the smarter man. There are many sources in which we derive our beliefs, and they aren't all from dialoging on facebook.

Jesse
That being said, it's no excuse for my laziness in my research. My other excuses are dealing with my personal relationships with my wife and God.

Damon
David, I forgot to mention, I wholeheartedly agree with you that in the end this fight is already won. That's comforting, but I still get caught up in the stress of fallen reality.

David
Nathan, I'm glad I'm helping you with your self-esteem. You just blew the hell out of mine. :)

Nathan
Trust me, the PR staffers have nothing on me. I'm an independent thinker, who usually votes for the green party candidate, but jumped ship during this last election. I'm still convinced I made the right decision as the alternative would have been, a repeat of GWBush and Dick Cheney, only a smokin hot Cheney.

I completely agree with your thought on consolidation of wealth and power, believe in co-ops and localizing money and capital. Are you familiar with David Korten? I'm still not convinced that money-as-debt is such a bad thing, when regulated, and think it is a far superior solution than a "gold standard."

Your prediction on China is, well, optimistic. They are moving quickly, as is India, but that prediction assumes a continual 7 -10% annual growth as well as consistent stabilization. There is just now way to tell. I can tell you that I work for a large contractor which earns a majority of it's projects from military construction. Right now there is an enormous build-up along the Pacific, and despise that we spend so much on self fulfilled prophecies, and creating our enemies. War gives us meaning. ... Read More

What do you think of the Carlyle Group?

Jesse
BTW Damon, thanks for the brilliant comments. I've heard of much you've said; but you articulated the evidence very well. Talk to you soon

Damon
But debt-based money is the vehicle to the consolidation of all the wealth and power. It creates the pyramid structure that is our dollar. The United States should not have to borrow money from a bank in order to have money. The constitution says the government should create it...should be an asset, not a debt. Jefferson tried to get an amendment to prevent the government from borrowing. He tried to prevent banks/corporations from ever transcending states. If only we listened.

Debt-based money and gold standard were basically the same thing...money created/lent/cycled based on the banker's promise to pay (whether he held gold or credit in reserve). The difference is without a gold standard the bankers can inflate beyond a sensible limit, which is the cause of the reset coming...the deflationary cycle we're about to go through.

You're right, neither is good. We need asset money. The government just needs to create it. Take it out of the hands of the private banking industry.... Read More

The math of debt-based money is the source of so many problems today. Given the nature of interest, the overall pile of credit must expand on a compound basis every year in order to keep the system afloat. That's an exponential growth model...inconsistent with life, physics, earth. Without jubilee or some other form of clearing out the system and putting the money changers on an equal playing field with everyone else, the debt-based system is guaranteed to result in a 2-class feudalistic world where the financiers and their servants in corporations have wealth and everyone else is a debtor.


more to come....